Ten Reasons why I despise the "Should People with Diabetes have Kids" debate
I made the mistake of reading the "Cheating Destiny" discussion at http://www.islet.org/forum/wwwboard.htm . I'm a little worked up, to say the least. So here are ten thoughts that went through my mind as I read.
10. I have kids. I bristle at being called selfish and immoral for having them.
9. It's a slippery slope. To say that people who know they RISK passing on a gene that MIGHT result in a chronic illness should not procreate is to say that NO ONE should have children.
8. Stopping people who have diabetes from having children will NOT eliminate diabetes! Neither of my parents have diabetes, nor is there any history of it in my family... so where did it come from!? Should ALL people with a history of an inheritable disease be discouraged from having children? Is there anyone genetically worthy of the honor of procreating?
7. Hearing people with diabetes who have decided not to have children because they would never pass such an awful condition onto their kids makes me SAD. I know I've been lucky with my diabetes, I know that there are people who suffer greatly, but it makes me sad to hear life with diabetes characterized as not worth it. They would honestly rather that they had never been born!
6. It is SO CRUEL to parents of children with diabetes. To tell them that their child's diagnosis is a TRAGEDY and to imply that their children should not have been born, it's nauseating.
5. The moment you apply the logic to other populations, it gets UGLY. Try it. Replace 'diabetes' with 'poverty-stricken' or 'history of cancer'.
4. It smacks of striving for genetic perfection. That's familiar, eh?
3. One person argued that we people with type 1 should be dead before we get the chance to procreate (if not for the insulin that keeps us alive). Well then, should we stop treating the flu in children? I mean, following that logic, only those hearty enough to survive *all* illnesses should be granted the privelege of parenthood. We're defeating natural selection with all this LIVING and Surviving we're doing.
2. The argument is based on faulty data and personal experience with diabetes. You cannot apply that to the population in general. It's like saying that no one should get married because your marriage sucked and the rate of divorce is high.
1. IT DENIES HOPE AND FAITH AND JOY and assumes that an imperfect life is a life not worth living. And that is perhaps the saddest thing I've ever heard.
posted by Kassie @ 12:59 PM
24 comments
24 Comments:
I haven't even read the discussion, but at this point, from your points, there's no WAY IN HELL, I'm going to read it! Especially since I've decided TODAY that I'm gearing up 100% for #2.
I'm shaking I'm so angry at some of the comments you've referenced.
Amen to everything you said.
I started to read these posts, because it's Friday afternoon and I needed to know what sparked this. WOW. I have always been blessed to be in positive supportive environments and did not even know thoughts like that could even be said. We can't what? ugh... There is a special place in hell for people who feel so genetically superior. I don’t even know what to say.
On a side note. I got your book. I'm so proud of your accomplishments. I loved reading about people I know and was again thankful for CBC. Way to go Kas!
Caren
It's funny, I'm way more concerned about passing along the depression that runs through the women of my family like a flash flood than I am about passing along diabetes, which no one else in my family has.
I have always intended to have children and while it isn't going to happen any time soon, I still plan on it. It has never occured to me that diabetes would be something that would stop me from doing so. That anyone would even suggest that I reconsider or that I would be a BAD person for bringing a child into the world is infuriating and downright ignorant.
I can also say from the point of view of a child of a person with diabetes and the sister of a peron with diabetes, that while diabetes is a pain, I am glad I was born and think that I am as valuable and successful and happy as a child without a father with diabetes or without diabetes herself.
Oddly enough, it just so happens that hammering VERY loudly right behind me is a beautiful almost-2-year-old boy named Luke who is the son of an incredible woman with diabetes. I guarentee you she has no regrets!
I'm speechless! My husband and I have just picked a date to start trying to get pregnant (4 months away!) and I've been working my butt off trying to get my body prepared to be home to our child (as I know many of you have too!)
If only every mother was as dedicated to being a parent as most of us type 1 moms to be are!
Oh, and Kassie, I purchased your book at Amazon, I guess it'll be available in September! Yeah!
Ugh, ugh, ugh.
As you know, we've (almost) come to a decision that we've made on our own about not having kids. I'm starting to believe that we make diabetes the reason when there is so much more to it than that for us.
Maybe a bigger reason than it should be, but like art-sweet said, we're probably both more worried about the depression that runs rampant in both our families. I would absolutely love to experience pregnancy and childbirth and the childhood of a youngster, but most of the time, I just don't want another human being going through the misery I've gone through with depression since puberty.
hey Judy - as far as 'they' know, the risk of developing Type 1 can be inherited. Men have a 7% chance of having a child with diabetes, women have anywhere from 1-4%.
Judy> There is a slight genetic link. My best friend is the only of her father's four children who does not have type 1 and my husband has a 2nd cousin who was diagnosed with it in her 20's, not long before he was.
I am sorry to say that I just followed your link, Kassie, and actually read some of that crap.
Amazing how much this sounds like Nazi bullshit...blonde haired, blue eyed, no islet cells, off with your head! And isn't it strange how very german the name Klausen is...
I am literally biting my fingers now to prevent myself from vomiting my opinion all over that website.
I'm having kids. Always wanted to have kids. And now these idiots just make me want 'em more.
AHMEN! whoa I did not read this but reading ur post made my mouth drop HUH??? we should be dead ?? huh oh my god! where you able to reply on this page?? I hope you gave it to them if you can MY GOD !
Good God, who even knew there was a debate about these things? I haven't read the link (and how interesting that you didn't make it a live link), but really, having children is a personal decision that's nobody's business but the woman choosing to get pregnant and her partner and/or sperm donor. I certainly don't need to listen to people question that choice.
OK, so I couldn't stay away from reading the link. What the responders are missing is that Cheating Destiny, a new book coming out in November by James Hirsch, as a whole, is a PHENOMENAL piece of work. I just finished reading an advance copy of it (Kassie, have you gotten one?) and I was planning to blog about it soon. It's a comprehensive look at the different facets of living with diabetes in America today: reporting on research, politics, memoirs, history. The author, James Hirsch, is a longtime journalist and the book takes a close look at all aspects of diabetes, as a condition, an epidemic, and a business. That his young son was diagnosed with type 1 decades after Hirsch's own diagnosis is a sad and ironic twist, but truly, it's just one piece of the pie that is this fascinating book. I highly recommend it.
I followed the link and decided to have fun and mock them mercilessly on Beanie Baby--hope you enjoy it. ;)
Kassie, you are right on so many levels, but scientifically, you are WAY right. Eliminating the long list of human disorders, metabolic or otherwise, is impossible. Who out there, without diabetes, is a "carrier" for such a genetic link? If we could screen everyone's genome we'd find that no one would be immune to such a fascist ideology. While I may feel anxious and nervous about having a 2nd kid, and I may feel under a lot o' pressure to "tame" the diabetes end of the pregnancy, it is not right to accuse me of bringing a "flawed" child into the world (potentiallly, at that). One look at my kid, my Type 1 brother's kids, and I'm sure yours, would prove this beyond a shadow of doubt.
My husband is a type 1 diabetic. We decided to have children. Along came a beautiful and perfect son. Nine months later, I was diagnosed with type 1 diabetes. My blood sugars are to eratic for me to try and have another child right now, but I am so grateful and blessed to have my son. Is he at risk? Yes. But life without him is unimaginable. Had I known that I would, too, get the BIG D, would I have had him? I think I still would have. I may have been a little more scared, but I believe in God and I pray. He is a healthy and happy 6 year old now, and I am blessed.
There are some terrible conditions that are passed genetically, for example - my two cousins died agonizing slow deaths from muscular dystrophy. This is a condition carried by the mother, but passed only to her sons. Daughters become carriers. It could be wiped out theoretically in a generation, if the known carriers did not reproduce. I've never heard that Type 1 diabetes had such a strong genetic cause. I know of no one in my family, besides me, who has Type 1 - or Type 2 for that matter. So, I do have children. I guess I believe there are some people who shouldn't have children for genetic reasons. It doesn't seem right to knowingly pass on a lifetime of suffering. I just don't see it applying to diabetes.
Anon, yes, there are conditions that people might decide are too dangerous to pass on. Tay-Sachs is another one that comes to mind - I know people who have decided not to have children when they learn that both parents are carriers. That's why there are genetic counselors - to help people identify their risks and make informed decisions.
I react (passionately) to anyone who makes a blanket statement about any group having children. The heat gets turned up when that statement is based on incorrect info.
With all the children ALREADY in the world who need homes and parents to love them, choosing to have a child biologically is morally questionable in any case. When you choose biological procreation over adoption, aren't you guilty of genetic narcissism in the first place? So that's my bias. I am a 27 year old type 1 diagnosed three months ago. My brother is now 24, diagnosed type 1 at age 9. My aunt is also a type 1 diagnosed in her twenties. OF COURSE there is a genetic link. I don't care what the percentages are; every type 1 diabetic I know shares my last name. Spreading this gene would be foolish and shortsighted. Think of the cost not only to the child, but to society. Adoption is a beautiful choice, and it gives back to the world at large. Creating more kids, especially kids with diseases, is a negative contribution.
Genetic narcissism. Hadn't heard that one before.
There is not always such a strong genetic link. I'm sorry, but I know a great deal of people with diabetes who do not have a single first degree relative with the condition. If you truly believe that potentially diseased genes should not be spread, then you are in favor of either ending all procreation or only allowing procreation when genetic health has been documented (which, considering the fact that we don't know that much about genes, is impossible).
Adoption is a beautiful choice, and I applaud anyone who pursues it (and has the means to pursue it). Having children is also a beautiful choice and I have a huge problem with anyone who tells other people they are selfish and foolish for having a child.
I think that to say people with diabetes shouldn't risk passing on diabetes is to say that people with diabetes in families with a strong genetic link should never have been born. Is that how you feel? Are you furious that you were brought into the world with imperfect genes? Shame on your parents for being so selfish and narcissistic!
Scroll up and read Nicole aka Fred's response. There is clearly a strong diabetes gene in her family but she seems to think that she's as valuable and happy as people without diabetes. She's the kind of person with diabetes I prefer to associate with (and am proud to know!)
Some diabetics and families of diabetics see diabetes in such a negative light. I am pregnant, my husband is type 1 with no family history and quite honestly if the baby is diabetic what are we going to do? Get on with it!
No-one has the right to decide who should or should not have a baby. In a couple of generations diabetes will probably be curable or so managable that the risk of complications will diminish. I also have a friend who was born with a hole in her heart who, a hundred years ago, would probably have died giving birth to her lovely son. I can't believe the genentic narcissim person feels that their birth was a negative contribution to society! Every birth is a negative contribution to society as it puts greater pressure on ressources!! Nature put us here to procreate and that is what we are going to do and there is no point looking any further into it!
Power to diabetics and their families!
I can't believe any one would think that a person with diabetes should not have children!! I am outraged by this! I have a son who was diagnosed with type one diabetes at 15 months. He is the happiest, brightest child 9now 7), I can't imagine life with out him!! Even if you were to have a child with diabetes, what would it matter? On top of that , the medical advances have come such a long way and there is so much promising research if not for a cure, but for devices which will give better control. Neither my husband or I have a family history of diabetes and we ended up having a child with the disease. we love him more than anything. I would hope tht no person with type one diabetes would ever decide to not have children in fear of passing it along. I am sorry that you had to even be exposed to this discussion. There is no way that I will read that discussion!!
Sorry but i'm going to be very blunt.
Yes i have diabetes, i also have an autoimmune disease that causes miniere's disease. i was born with Arnold Chairia Malformation which was corrected with neurosugery.
Diabetes is to a very high point genetic, my mother has it and i have no wish to procreate and bring a child into the world knowing that there is a 90 per sent probability that my child will develope it too.
This kind of thing really grinds my gears when people have genetic illness and wish to have children knowing full well that the child is most likely going to have the same disease as the parents. If you want a kid that much then for heavens sake adopt one, don't bring another sick child into this world needlessly !
Skeeter, isn't it wonderful that you get to decide what you want to do with your life? Isn't it great that you can look at your particular situation: your family history, your feelings about life with diabetes, and your hopes for your own future... and make your own decision?
You should consider extending that courtesy to everyone else.
Post a Comment
<< Home